Over processed, Digitally manipulated photos.

[shootem]

Hello All,
Stopping by again for a look see, at the contest area. Life has been in a bit of a turmoil of late, and I haven't been posting for a while.
I am a bit surprised at the number of digitally over enhanced and over processed pictures this week. It saddens me that excellent artists such as Reza and Autumsky were "run off" by having their photos that did not meet contest regulations pulled from the weekly contests - and now, these same types of artistic work are being left on - and our old friends are gone.
It is either allowed, or not. Members awarding high scores to these photos are encouraging this type of work. Is this what we want as a community? If so - maybe once again we can approach the administrators for a category for this type of work.
It is my opinion that a few "older" members have just "gotten away with over enhancing" and many "newer" members simply have not read the contest guidelines to see what is allowed. Our photos are supposed to be "straight shots", and as I mentioned above, many this week in particular, are not.
May I guide those of you that have NOT read our guidelines to:
http://www.bytephoto.com/modules.php...howpage&pid=12
I appreciate artistic work, but the contest area is dedicated to "straight shots".
Let's either change this, or abide by it. And if the administration does not remove shots that don't qualify, how about we comment, but don't rate.... Or mark the rating down accordingly...
What are your thoughts?

[Bytephoto]

I think most members abide by the guidelines some read them and forget, some don't read them, and some just knowingly post only go get views or comments
We will stick with the 'straight shots' rule for know, and when a photo seems to have been over manipulated just let us know by using the 'report photo' link (found beneath the photo).
Last week there was a photo removed for this reason.
So please remember let the admins know by using the 'report photo' link. Thanks

[famjad21]

I have very mixed feelings about this subject. As someone who still has scars from mixing my own stop bath in a darkroom, I have come to love the ease and capability given to us by the digital photography revolution. My Photoshop skills have grown to a level that I could never duplicate in the darkroom (I never had the skill or equipment to employ masks). The sad side of this is that it has become too easy. This week, and with the click of the mouse, I have been turning dull snapshots into a spectacular autumn photographs. I would love to submit them but I won’‚’‚…‚’‚…¾‚t.

I think the contest rules are fair and should be followed as they are stated. The problem, as I see it, is that we want our peers to see and comment on our latest creations. As our post processing skills improve, the creations move farther from the ’‚’‚…‚’‚¹¦‚“original’‚’‚…‚’‚…¾‚ shot.

Using the contest seems to be the best avenue to get the critiques that are so valuable. Maybe we should have a click box stating eligibility.

Frank

Hi shootem

I find your comments about overprocessed, digitally manipulated photos interesting. You mention that the rules should be changed if we are going to allow this type of photo. Allow me to quote a section of the rules.


PHOTO MODIFICATIONS Photos edited using the methods below are acceptable in the competition.
’‚’‚…‚’‚‚ Levels, brightness, contrast, curves, gamma, intensity, tone, hue, saturation, desaturation, lightness, channel adjustment, colour balance, tint, resizing, cropping, burning and dodging selective areas. Various filters to sharpen, soften, blur, despeckle, add grain and remove noise, can also be used to create a better final image. Remember photos should only be edited to improve the final image not totally change it.
NOTE: In some cases judges may ask to view the original file.

’‚’‚…‚’‚‚ The use of a cloning stamp tool may be used to remove minor and small unwanted objects, such as telephone poles, cables and power lines, debris etc.


These rules would allow most people the ability to do whatever they wish to a photo. I have to tell you that I was told recently that I had enter the best photo ever and it was after I applied the above rules.
I am like a lot of "old" darkroom guys who now are in heaven sitting at a computer because I can now do what I once only dreamed about.......using the above rules. Conversely there will always be people who like to "bend" the rules to see how ar they can go......not always a bad thing.

I love a straight photo also....but I believe that many people are using the rules and rightly so........hope I have been helpful

Similiar to Frank....I also have many scar from mixing darkroom chemicals.......love the smell of stop bath

Ray

[RTaylor]

I think many people just getting into photography sine digital have no clue as to the processing the camera shops would do in respect to levels and contrast to make our "snapshots" look a bit better.
Do you think Ansel Adams just took a picture right out of the camera and it was perfect?
He too spent time dodging and burning.
A good photographer friend of mine who does portraits and wedding shots, told me that photographers adjust their photos all the time to make them the best they can be.

I agree with Parklawn.. all the above are in the rules and there is nothing wrong with posting a picture at byte that you adjusted.
Everyone who is into Digital should know by now that all pictures taken with a digital camera need adjusting. If they didnt, then you wouldnt see so much photo software out there for professionals to do so

[famjad21]

I am curious about using camera based filters like the Cokin system. There are some very spectacular effects obtainable that don't look natural. Is this considered a straight shot?

My feeling is that it should be but then that places the experienced PS user at a disadvantage.

Frank

[shootem]

Ruth, Ray, and Frank - I must not have made myself clear. Sorry. I completely agree we should be able to (and I do) post process our pictures. My comment was directed towards a few photos that had been completely altered. Not just adjusted. I myself clone out artifacts, adjust levels, curves, resize, and sharpen. Occasionally I'll also boost saturation. I use a polarizing filter. I use Galen Rowel ND grads.
Of course I realize Ansel Adams did a LOT of post processing. He is one of my mentors, I read his books, and aspire to develope my ability to "see" things, the way he did.
If we shoot in Raw, we have to post process. There is no in camera processing.
I am talking about a photograph that looks nothing like the original shot.
Digital Art. It's beautiful, but at this time, not allowed according to the guidelines in the contest area. I am simply saying that by scoring (especially high) a completely manipulated photo, we are incouraging this. If this is what we want, fine, but then the guidelines would have to be changed. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
Cheers

[shootem]

Please see:

PHOTO MODIFICATIONS Photos edited using the methods below are acceptable in the competition.
Levels, brightness, contrast, curves, gamma, intensity, tone, hue, saturation, desaturation, lightness, channel adjustment, colour balance, tint, resizing, cropping, burning and dodging selective areas. Various filters to sharpen, soften, blur, despeckle, add grain and remove noise, can also be used to create a better final image. Remember photos should only be edited to improve the final image NOT TOTALLY CHANGE IT. NOTE: In some cases judges may ask to view the original file.
The use of a cloning stamp tool may be used to remove minor and small unwanted objects, such as telephone poles, cables and power lines, debris etc.

No elaborate frames, however photo matting is are allowed, such as the following examples. [a] [b]
Signatures, watermarks, titles and copyright notices may be added, however, large distracting ones may weaken the chances on receiving justified ratings.

In order to have your photos displayed at their best, a suggestion is to upload photos at 800 pixels in height or in width, and this way the system will not create a medium image size of average quality.

[Sue North]

Hi I am know to this sit and am finding my ray sloly I ave no props whith manebaltet hpotos if thay ar overos. I ded look at the rolse and all so at the hpotos on the site to see whate wase alard. so I whald not pot sumthingk that wase not ok I up that my hpoto wase okand didnot gous sume gif. This is my ferst ever foam. I am still lerning.
P S
I do not know if I pot my photos in the rigt comp if atall.
Regards
Sue.

[Sue North]

P S my be we shald have a comp foar just manebilated photos.
Regards
Sue

[MikeyB]

yep, I agree with shootem that there needs to be clarification on the rules and submission specifications. It would be nice to have a seperate contest for pictures that have been considerably altered as that would give us a good avenue to show this work as the current rules don't allow for deviating too far from the original image. And of course, we all modify our levels, curves, sharpness etc before we post for POTW as this is allowed and expected. Funnily enough, this is exactly what i was trying to explain to Ray a couple of weeks ago, glad he understands now though

I am sorry I missed this........I do understand MikeyB......you called ma a cheater and wanted to pass it off as just having fun.............

I don't understand how rudeness can be passed off as "fun"

Seems that we just went through a while bunch of nonsense with another member who thought he was having "fun" by embarassing and belittling another member.......

Sorry but I guess I just don't get it!!!!

Apologies are nice........so are mature people

[MikeyB]

orignally the point I was trying to make was the same as shootem's, but it quickly got side tracked onto another issue that was unintented by myself and which I regret. If you can not see that then I am sorry, I hope soon we'll be able to move past this

[MikeyB]

... -> if you had allowed my to explain my opinion after my initial misplaced remark, as opposed to dwelling on it, then you would have seen - through reasoned discussion as I had hoped for - that I was raising the issue of un-clear submission rules. I am sorry if it sounded like it was an accusation against you, Ray, I really am

Thank you..thats what I have been waiting to hear, if I seem abrupt, I guess I was, but in light of your recent comments, thank you for your apology and I am prepared to move on and not to dwell on it any further.

Lets enjoy the purpose of this website...photography and the learning of it from each other

Ray